Dwarf Anvil in the top of turn one

This game up in an ally game tonight
BRB re: vanguard troops "can't charge in turn one if the go first."

Is this legal?

Vanguard unit advances
win roll to go first
top of turn one, movement - vanguard unit advances; however per the rules, does not charge.
top of turn one, shooting - Successfully strike the anvil to move 1 unit.

Can you now decalre charge with the Vanguard unit?

Ii would say yes, cause the rules for the Vanguard unit is a General Rule. The Anvil makes the unit work outside of the General rules, is a special effect.
The Anvil is a Unique Unit and as such it works based on what the Dwarf army book says, Unique unit entries go over BRB rules, as noted on the BRB.

luis the young wrote:Ii would say yes, cause the rules for the Vanguard unit is a General Rule. The Anvil makes the unit work outside of the General rules, is a special effect.
The Anvil is a Unique Unit and as such it works based on what the Dwarf army book says, Unique unit entries go over BRB rules, as noted on the BRB.

That's the same train of logic I'd follow. The Vanguad unit can't charge, another unit/model is making them charge. Should work the same with spells that allow you to charge, right?

The Euro players all said no.

Dwarf Book RAW - 1 Dwarf unit may make a free Move or Charge in the shooting phase.

BRB - ....can not declare a charge on turn 1

So if you can't declare - you can not charge as it is still "turn 1"

That was the argument they presented anyway.....

That sounds about as simple and strong an argument can be presented.

But I thought army books overrode brb. Not making a call on this one, just saying....

KingdomCome wrote:But I thought army books overrode brb. Not making a call on this one, just saying....

Even then, when it ends up on an FAQ after lots of head scratching.... GW will make an arbitrary call on the matter.

Dwarven flame guns were not flaming for quite a long time in their errata during 7th, for example.

Did it make it into a faq yet?

KingdomCome wrote:Did it make it into a faq yet?

They count as Fire Throwers now, yeah.

Bill, the anvil says 1 DWARF unit can make a free move or charge. So you wouldn't be able to target your allied units anyways because they aren't dwarves right?

Diosamblet wrote:Bill, the anvil says 1 DWARF unit can make a free move or charge. So you wouldn't be able to target your allied units anyways because they aren't dwarves right?

That should end the argument right there

But the whole Vanguard/Declare charge thing, you declare charges at the beguinign of the turn on the Charge phase, a unit with vanguard cannot declare a charge on turn one at tha point. Anything after that is after the declare charge phase, the vanguard unit is NOT declaring a charge on the charge phase, its the target of an effect that Lets it charge outside of that phase. Kinda like me using magic to make my Tomb Kings charge.

correct Matt - the Euro rule lawyers pointed that out as well